Show NotesQuestions for Reflection
Each episode we offer you a few prompts to think about how that day's conversation applies to you. You might pause the podcast and answer them right then and there, but if you keep a journal (Steph and Beth both do), you might find one of these PDFs useful. Choose the orientation that fits best in your journal.
Transcript
Beth Demme (00:04):
Welcome to the Discovering our Scars podcast. Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:06): Where we have honest conversations about things that make us different. I'm Steph. Beth Demme (00:10): And I'm Beth. Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:11): I've been in recovery for 13 plus years, and I'm the author of Discovering my Scars, my memoir about my mental health struggles, experiences, and faith. Beth Demme (00:18): I'm a lawyer turned pastor who's all about self-awareness and emotional health because I know what it's like to have neither of those things. Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:24): Beth and I have been friends for six years, have gone through recovery program together, and when I wanted to start a podcast, she's the only name that came to mind as co-host. Beth Demme (00:31): I didn't hesitate to say yes because I've learned a lot from honest conversations with Steph over the years. Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:37): We value honest conversations and we hope you do too. Beth Demme (00:40): That's why we do this and why we want you to be part of what we are discussing today. What is our topic today, Steph? Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:46): Today, we are going to propose a question, "Are you the authority on you?" Beth Demme (00:53): Ooh, good question. Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:55): Yeah. Beth Demme (00:55): Do you love yourself enough, right? Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:57): Are you the one that knows you the best and the most? I think the obvious question is, or the obvious answer is ... Beth Demme (01:04): Yes, hopefully. Stephanie Kostopoulos (01:05): I'm me. How can I not know me? Stephanie Kostopoulos (01:07): Right, right? Beth Demme (01:08): Well I think self-awareness is not easy for everybody. It's a something that you and I place a high value on. You know, we've talked about it on the podcast, you talk about it in your book, I talk about it in the Foreword. Self awareness is a big deal to you and to me, but I don't think it's important to everybody, it seems. I don't know, what do you think keeps people from self-awareness? Stephanie Kostopoulos (01:29): That's an interesting question. All I know is me. I do think I'm the authority on me, but I haven't always been. I haven't always known fully who I am. I think a part of the reason is I was afraid of what what I might find. I was also afraid I wouldn't like myself because there was a long time where I didn't like myself. I didn't realize it at the time, but I didn't like me. I thought I was boring and not fun and not cool to be around and I didn't love myself. I love myself now. I'm the coolest person. Beth Demme (02:03): You're the coolest person in this room right now, for sure. Stephanie Kostopoulos (02:06): Mac's pretty cool, I'm not going to lie. Beth Demme (02:08): She's not a person. Stephanie Kostopoulos (02:11): She breathes. Beth Demme (02:12): She's dog. She's not a person. Stephanie Kostopoulos (02:14): She has thoughts and feelings and emotions. Beth Demme (02:16): She is a beautiful created being; she's not a person. Stephanie Kostopoulos (02:21): She's not a human being, that is correct. Stephanie Kostopoulos (02:24): She's my person though. Stephanie Kostopoulos (02:25): Anyways, I think it's a lot of fear of what you might find when you really spend time with yourself and exploring every aspect of you. So for me, when I ... starting college, I started having really deep depression in dealing with self-injury, which is now called non-suicidal self-injury. I would essentially hurt myself to make me feel better. It sounds very counter-intuitive, but that's how I felt, how it would help me feel. For the longest time, I dealt with that for a long time. For many years, it's all in my book, but for many years I dealt with that and I didn't know why that kept being my go to action. I wanted to stop that being my go to action because it did not satisfy me anymore the longer it went on. Stephanie Kostopoulos (03:10): I finally was at my lowest and was like, "I have to know all of me." I have to know the ins and outs of me. When I finally got to that vulnerable place where I was finally, even though the fear was there, the courage set forward and I ... and to find out truly who I was, that's when I turned to God and I said, you know, "I need to know my story. I need to know what happened to me." That's when I found out about the abuse and that's when I found out about a couple of things from childhood and everything that led to where I am and I saw the complete full picture of me. That's when I truly was able to start to love me was when I knew me and all of the hurts and all the things that had happened. Stephanie Kostopoulos (03:51): I have to make time for that. I have to remind myself and I have to forgive myself for things. Something happened yesterday, actually, that I was thinking about and I was like kicking myself. I was like, "Why did I say that?" Then I was like, "No, I need to forgive myself." Literally this morning I was like, "I'm going to forgive myself for doing that because all of these other things were great. This was good. I'm so glad I did this. I can forgive myself for this." Beth Demme (04:11): So you were in a place where you didn't really like yourself. I think that is in many ways a universal experience. The paradox of it is you were in a place where you didn't really like yourself, so you took time to really get to know yourself better, and that takes risk, right? Because if you're already feeling like, oh, "Maybe I don't really like myself and I'm going to take time to really find out who I am. Oh, what if I find something that's really, you know ..." Stephanie Kostopoulos (04:33): I did find something bad. Beth Demme (04:35): You did. Stephanie Kostopoulos (04:35): I found the thing I was fearing the most. That was always in the back of my head. I had a fear that I was abused or I had a fear that I had been raped. That was my fear and that's what had happened. Once I came to that realization that that is actual truth, that is what happened, it actually didn't crumble me. It actually made me stronger and made me able to move forward. So it did the opposite. As much as I was so scared and so fearful of it, I took that step and I can see how all of those things, I wouldn't go back and change those things. This is my life. I'm where I am today because of those things. I find that I'm stronger for it, but I don't feel like if I had not done that hard work and learned those pieces, I don't think I'd be where I am today. Stephanie Kostopoulos (05:21): But what about you, Beth? I would say you're a very self-aware person. Do you feel like you've always been that way? Beth Demme (05:29): No, I definitely have not always been self aware. It's easy to get busy and to distract yourself, and when you combine that with a little bit of denial, I think that it sustained me for a long time and I think that I know people today who it is continuing to sustain them. Stephanie Kostopoulos (05:47): Do you think busy-ness helps distract from self-awareness? Beth Demme (05:51): I definitely think that busy-ness is a distraction from self-awareness and I think also busyness is a justification for not engaging in the work of self awareness because there was a season when I remember thinking, I literally don't have time to think about that. If I go down that rabbit hole, I'm just going to go down, down, down, down, down, and I don't have time to be down right now. I've got to get stuff done. So I'm like, what's that line out of Gone With The Wind with Scarlett O'Hara, you know? "Oh, I'll think about it tomorrow." Did she say something like that? Stephanie Kostopoulos (06:27): I don't know. Beth Demme (06:28): Oh, man. Stephanie Kostopoulos (06:29): Sorry, I don't think I've seen that movie. Beth Demme (06:31): Yeah, it's a Scarlett O'Hara quote from Gone With The Wind. She says, "I'll think about that tomorrow. Tomorrow is another day." Stephanie Kostopoulos (06:37): That's interesting because my quote is like the opposite of that. I live by the quote, "Take it one day at a time," and so I live in today. That's all I have is today. I focus on today. I don't focus on tomorrow because that's what overwhelms me. Beth Demme (06:50): No time like the present, unless you're Scarlett O'Hara and then there's no time like tomorrow. Stephanie Kostopoulos (06:55): Oh wow. Okay. Beth Demme (06:56): So yeah, so I do think that people use busyness as a way to put off doing the work of self-awareness because self-awareness does take work. Stephanie Kostopoulos (07:05): Yes. Beth Demme (07:06): And also in that way, actually I think in some respects, self-awareness is a luxury. Stephanie Kostopoulos (07:10): Yeah. Beth Demme (07:11): You know, I think that there are lots of people who don't have the time or the emotional bandwidth to really, to do that work. But it is important work. Stephanie Kostopoulos (07:20): I think it's a big thing that happens in recovery programs is self-awareness. I mean that's a hard thing. I mean I remember when we were going through it is like every day that we are ... I mean all the questions were about me. Just about me. Not any ... I didn't have to study for them. I just, it was about me. I had to do that self-reflection every time and that was hard and I think that's probably why a lot of people are hesitant to be involved with recovery programs because as much as it seems like it should be the easiest thing in the world, it's work. Beth Demme (07:51): It's easier to think about the ways other people need to change than to face ... Stephanie Kostopoulos (07:55): Oh, yeah. Beth Demme (07:55): ... the ways that you individually need to change. It's much easier to look at other people but you, anyone who's listening to this right now, you are worth getting to know. It's worth it for you to take the time to really get to know yourself. You have inherent self-worth. So let me ask you, Steph. Actually, this is a question you asked me, but now I'm going to flip it back on you. Do you think that it is possible to love someone else if you don't love yourself? Stephanie Kostopoulos (08:19): Interesting. That is a good question. I asked you that? That was my question? Wow? Beth Demme (08:24): No wonder you think it's a good question. You asked me this question recently. Stephanie Kostopoulos (08:27): Did I? Beth Demme (08:28): And I've been pondering it. Stephanie Kostopoulos (08:29): I don't remember your answer. Did you answer it? Beth Demme (08:31): Yes, I have an answer. Stephanie Kostopoulos (08:32): Okay. My answer is I don't think you can truly love someone else without loving yourself. That is my answer, which is why I am not married because I had to know who I was before I could be ready for another. But I am ready so if you are between the ages of ... what ages? Beth Demme (08:53): We should say like between the ages of 30 and 40s? Stephanie Kostopoulos (08:55): In the 30. No, not 40. Ugh. Beth Demme (08:57): Between 30 and 40. Stephanie Kostopoulos (08:59): Oh, okay. Beth Demme (08:59): All right, sorry. Between 30 and 39 and three quarters. Stephanie Kostopoulos (09:02): Yes. Beth Demme (09:03): Call in. Let us know. Stephanie Kostopoulos (09:04): Send it as a text message. Don't call it, it might be weird. We won't use this as my dating profile. So same question, Beth. Can you love another person fully without loving yourself? Beth Demme (09:15): Yes, I think you can. Stephanie Kostopoulos (09:17): Okay. Well. Beth Demme (09:19): My experience is that my husband and I have been together since high school. He brought me flowers on my 16th birthday. If you've been a podcast listener for a while, you may have heard Charlene Collin, she's been my friend for a long time. She had a surprise birthday party for me when I turned 16 and Steven came to that party and brought me flowers. Stephanie Kostopoulos (09:37): Oh my gosh. Beth Demme (09:38): So we've been together a long time. For sure, early in our marriage, I didn't know myself well enough to really love myself, but being loved by him opened up a space where it was safe for me to do that emotional work. It's one of the advantages of having gotten married really young is that we really have grown up together. That doesn't work for everybody. In fact, I think usually it doesn't work for people. Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:04): I was going to say, I don't know if we're recommending that. Beth Demme (10:07): I wouldn't recommend it, but it has been very good for me to ... because he is able to kind of hold this space and then I think I've done that for him as well so that we have each been able to do our emotional work. Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:21): I've never been married, but I know a lot of people have been divorced and I feel like ... and I don't usually know why people get divorced, but I feel like that could lead to divorce, is that people don't love themselves and if you don't love yourself, can you truly, fully love another person? You know? What's that quote from the Bible? "Love your neighbor as yourself"? Beth Demme (10:41): Yeah, that's in the Bible. Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:42): If you don't love yourself, how do you love your neighbor well? How do you love your spouse well if you don't love yourself. Especially getting married young — you obviously are different situation — but especially getting married young, not knowing yourself at all, much less love. Like even knowing who you are, what you want to do. If you guys don't complement each other in the in the right ways, I can see where that divorce rate can be high because of that. Beth Demme (11:06): Yeah, I was 20 when we got married. I was young. Stephanie Kostopoulos (11:08): Wow. Beth Demme (11:09): Yeah. But I think also people sometimes get to a point in any long-term relationship, including marriage, where if you're in a place where you don't really like yourself, you can't understand why someone else would like you much less love you. So then you start to doubt the level of this commitment because, "Well, I'm not really lovable, so they don't really love me." Right? And so it's okay to maybe be unfaithful because, right? They don't really love me anyway. Stephanie Kostopoulos (11:40): You know It's an easy out. Beth Demme (11:41): Yeah. Stephanie Kostopoulos (11:41): Yeah. Beth Demme (11:42): I do feel like I have seen that a handful of times and it's really heartbreaking to see that and to know this person who I really like doesn't like themselves enough to do their emotional work and to be emotionally healthy. Stephanie Kostopoulos (11:58): Do you think knowing you fully and honestly is important in the workplace? Is it important in your daily life? Beth Demme (12:06): I can't think of a situation where it's not important actually, because in any type of situation where you're going to have human interaction, there's a chance that the other human you're interacting with is going to bump up against one of your sore spots. If you are self-aware, then you know, "Oh, that's why that hurts so much is because it's because of something I'm dealing with." If you aren't very self aware, then you tend to think it's all about what other people are doing. "Oh, so-and-so should have said that to me," but really so-and-so didn't mean anything by it. It just rubbed a raw spot on my heart and so I have, you know, I really genuinely am hurt by it, but it's my work that needs to be done. Stephanie Kostopoulos (12:48): Yeah, I would definitely agree. When I worked for Apple, I was a leader and there was definitely, ... I knew professional me and I knew I the schools I had and I was working on these skills and dah, dah, dah, dah. But there's things that really crumbled me when I worked there and things that just kind of, I like went home and just cried for hours because of things that happened. If I had fully known myself at that time, I would have been able to head those off before they even happened and I would know, like when someone triggers something in me, I would know, "Okay, well that's related to this and this is a totally different situation. This is not going to crumble me." I've dealt with the stuff that could have been a trigger before kind of thing. So I definitely see it will make you stronger and better in all aspects of your life by knowing all of you. Beth Demme (13:36): So here's an example that happened to me recently that I think when you hear this story, you'll be, you will see how wrong I was right away. Right? Stephanie Kostopoulos (13:44): You're never wrong. Beth Demme (13:44): No, no, no. Stephanie Kostopoulos (13:45): My goodness. Beth Demme (13:46): I recently was at a high school sporting event. I have two kids who are in high school. At halftime for this event, they invited all breast cancer survivors to come to the field to be honored and recognized. And it hurt my feelings because they said breast cancer survivors and I have had ovarian cancer, not breast cancer. So I got all up in myself and I was like, "I can't believe that they're going to just exclude me." Like, "Oh, now I'm not even cool enough to have the right kind of cancer. Thanks, guys." Like I totally had a moment in my head about it, right? Beth Demme (14:22): Because I have done a lot of emotional work and I have worked with a counselor and like I've gotten a lot of my stuff out pretty quickly. I was able to go, "Oh, this is about me. This is about work that I need to do. It's not about something that this organization ... it's not that this organization has somehow slighted me." Right? Of course we should celebrate breast cancer survivors. So I was trying to just think of kind of an example of I have tended to put it off on other people and really it was my work. That was one of those moments where my initial reaction was, "They're doing this wrong." Stephanie Kostopoulos (14:52): Oh yeah. Stephanie Kostopoulos (14:53): But actually they were doing it perfectly right, it was that I needed to do some work on that sore spot. Stephanie Kostopoulos (14:58): Oh yeah. I think that happens a lot where people will blame an outside source because it's easier to blame that outside source than actually looking in and saying, "Why does it bothering me so much? Why am I getting so worked up about this?" Stephanie Kostopoulos (15:10): There's times where I'll have a lot of things, little things that I haven't really dealt with and then one thing will happen and I'll just like explode and it's because I haven't worked on those little things because I constantly have to be aware of those things and work on them so that they don't become a big thing like that. Beth Demme (15:26): Yeah, but at some level you have to know your worth doing that work. We can put a link to this in the show notes, but I recently watched a video, it's from 2017 so a few years ago. Will Ferrell gave the commencement address at USC, which was his alma mater and they had given him an honorary doctorate degree. Of course, he's a hilarious human being and so he was really funny in how he delivered and everything, but he shared a very heartwarming story sort of in the middle of it where he talked about knowing that he could make his friends laugh and thinking that that was okay, but then realizing that someone who he didn't already have a relationship with thought he was funny. It was a random professor and how the professor had really validated him and had invited him to do something that was funny and how that made him embrace what he described, it was his word, he described "the weird side" of himself. It's okay to be funny and weird, that it was okay to really be himself, and how that really changed the trajectory of life and his career. Beth Demme (16:33): I think that's kind of what we're saying too, is it's okay to really be your true self, but you got to know who your true self is. Are you the authority on you? Are you enough of an authority about yourself that you can be your true self? Stephanie Kostopoulos (16:47): I really liked that story, Beth, because it sounds like he had, it really helped push him along by having supportive people in his life. Do you think having support, having a really strong support group, you know, one or two people or group, however you have it, do you think that is key to knowing yourself? Beth Demme (17:03): I mean, I definitely think that it helps. It helps to have people who are willing to like you even when you don't like yourself, so that you can, they can carry you through those times. Beth Demme (17:15): I mean, it sounds ... it might sound like weakness to some people. To say there are going to be times when your friends or your significant other maybe need to carry you for a bit emotionally, but it's true. I think sometimes we see this ... we were recently with some, with a group of people and in this group of people there was a couple, and their way of interacting with each other was to belittle each other and so ... Stephanie Kostopoulos (17:39): Not support each other. Beth Demme (17:40): Right, but not in an overtly mean way, but in a way that was like, "Oh, don't ask him that question. He won't know answer," or ... Stephanie Kostopoulos (17:50): [inaudible 00:00:17:51]. Beth Demme (17:51): Yeah. Stephanie Kostopoulos (17:51): I've observed that in a couple that I know and it's kind of like, like sometimes the husband like put down the wife, not in like a abusive way, but just kind of in a psychological way. I was like "What? Why would you say that she's not good at that? Why would you just automatically say that?" Yeah and not be supportive or encouraging of the person. Just like you know their faults and you're going to make sure that they stay their faults kind of thing. Because you know, if you're talking about something and they're not good at that, "Oh I'm going to make sure you know they're not good at that, cause they're never going to get better." Beth Demme (18:25): Yeah, and then try to laugh it off. Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:26): Yeah. Beth Demme (18:27): You know, like ... Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:27): I wonder if that leads to divorce. Beth Demme (18:29): I mean, I think that it could because if you don't feel supported and you don't feel like you're okay, that's not going to make for a healthy long-term relationship. Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:40): I don't think we have enough authority on a divorce to really talk about this. Well, we don't have an authority on anything. Beth Demme (18:45): We don't. Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:45): But we don't have context. So maybe we should bring a divorce person on to have a better conversation about this. Beth Demme (18:50): I mean, I really think every divorce is unique. Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:53): Yeah, that's true. Beth Demme (18:54): And is the result of unique circumstances so I don't want to paint it with a broad brush. Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:00): It would just be their experience. Beth Demme (19:02): Yeah. Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:02): Because like my experience with self-injury, that's only my experience. All I can talk about is mine. So I don't know, maybe we should add it to the list. Beth Demme (19:12): Maybe we should. I recently shared about my adoption story. That's my adoption story. Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:16): Yeah, exactly. Beth Demme (19:17): Every single one is unique. Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:18): Yeah. Yeah. Beth Demme (19:19): So I did have an experience one time where I didn't realize that I was doing it, but I had a friend say to me, "You know, I like spending time with you because you say nice things about your husband." Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:28): Oh, interesting. Beth Demme (19:29): I was like, "What do you mean?" It was true that we were kind of in ... this was when we all had toddlers and that is a hard time in a marriage. I'm just going to just going to tell you. That is a hard time. It's hard to live with toddlers. They're very tyrannical and- Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:41): What? Beth Demme (19:41): It's hard. Oh yes. Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:43): What's tyrannical? Beth Demme (19:44): Like tyrants. Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:45): I've never heard that word before. Beth Demme (19:46): [crosstalk 00:19:48]. Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:47): Oh my goodness. Beth Demme (19:50): So anyway, because it was a hard time, it was one of those times too where a lot of us were looking outward instead of doing our own work, our husbands got kind of caught in the cross hairs of that a lot, you know? "Oh, if he would just do this or he would just do that." I realized pretty quickly that I didn't feel good when I said unpleasant things about my husband and so I tried to really focus on all the things that were right. When I started sharing those, it sort of, this friend noticed and so, and she pointed out to me that she had noticed and I was like, "Oh yeah I have started to do that. You're right," because I really want to focus on the positive. But also I had started to do a lot of my own work by then and so it was easier to see the positive because I wasn't trying to just project all my negative on to everybody else. Stephanie Kostopoulos (20:37): I also think being the authority of you, it doesn't mean you, it's one and done kind of thing. I don't think you become it and it's done. Beth Demme (20:44): Good point. Stephanie Kostopoulos (20:45): Yeah. Beth Demme (20:45): Good point. Stephanie Kostopoulos (20:45): I think it's a ongoing process because you might put the hard work in now, but if you aren't continuing to do that work, you can get back to not a great situation. What we were just talking about, I think having supportive people can really help that process of you continuing to love yourself and know yourself. I've had that in my life where I have somebody in my life currently that is not supportive and if I say yes, they say no. If I say right, they say left. It doesn't matter what it is but they are completely unsupportive of everything. I had to come to a realization that this is who they are and that's not going to change and I want to replace them with someone that is supportive. Stephanie Kostopoulos (21:30): So I actually have a really good friend, the friend that drew the took the picture for the front cover of my book, my friend Daniel. I have basically kind of adopted him as a family member and look at him as a brother, as somebody that is, he's always been so supportive of me, I write about it in the book. He and his family are just so great. Also, they just got a Greyhound. Unrelated but- Beth Demme (21:54): That makes it even greater. Stephanie Kostopoulos (21:55): Excited. They just got a greyhound, his name is Max with an X and I have Mac with a C. Super exciting. I was like so excited when he got his greyhound. Anyways, that was off topic, but I just had to put that out there because he heard our greyhound episode and then went and got greyhounds. No, they had been thinking about it for a while but ... Beth Demme (22:13): Any excuse to plug the greyhounds, right? Stephanie Kostopoulos (22:15): Yes. And if you ... we'll put a link to the adoption agency if you're interested in the greyhound. But I use him as a support in my life, as someone that is super supportive of me. I seek that out and I kind of looked at my life and I said, okay, who are the people that I want to keep in my life that I want to have in that constant rotation? He was at the top of the list, this is somebody that is supportive of my choices and helps be my cheerleader and not discourage those. I think sometimes we have to do, I've had to do the hard work of people that, I can choose people that I want to have in my life and I can sit back from people that aren't good for me. Beth Demme (22:53): That's a whole 'nother episode. You just described like doing a friend audit or something. I just don't know about that stuff, I don't know- Stephanie Kostopoulos (22:59): It's interesting because Daniel did the same thing recently. We should interview him about it because he literally did it more as like an actual thing. He like audited his friends and said who does he want to have in his life right now? And those were the only ones he takes text messages from. Beth Demme (23:13): Wow. Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:13): Because he had like hundreds of text messages unread. I was like, "What? Text messages? This is ridiculous." And he's like, "Yeah, I only look and answer the ones of people that are in my top group right now." And I was like, "You answer mine." He's like, "Because you're in that group." I mean man, that was special. Beth Demme (23:31): Wow. Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:31): I know. So if you want to truly learn about friend audit, we'll talk to him about it. Beth Demme (23:37): This is an audio format so you cannot see the horror on my face right now, but I am gobsmacked. Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:43): What? To audit your friends? Beth Demme (23:44): Yes. Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:45): I think we all do it in just not an official way. Like there's been seasons of friends and like ... Beth Demme (23:50): But that happens naturally. It's not like I'm going to sit down and audit people out. Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:55): He did it officially. Yeah, he did it officially. Beth Demme (23:57): Yeah. Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:57): Which was like, yeah- Beth Demme (23:58): I'm glad you made the cut because he sounds intense. Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:00): I know, but he's not intense. He's like the nicest person you'll ever meet. [crosstalk 00:00:24:03]. Beth Demme (24:05): But people whose text messages you're ignoring do not think that- Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:08): That's self awareness though. That's pretty cool. He's so self aware that he knows he only has so much time in a day and these are the places he wants to put his time. Beth Demme (24:16): I guess he's an authority on himself. Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:17): He must be. Yes. Beth Demme (24:20): We're impressed, Daniel. Way to go. Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:22): High five, Daniel. Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:29): Thank you for joining us today on the podcast. We, we want to let you know that we both actually have weekly newsletters that we send out. Email newsletters, we don't mail it. Beth Demme (24:38): Don't get crazy. Snail mail, ugh. Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:41): Snail mail has a time and place. It has its own place. Beth Demme (24:44): Not for our newsletters. Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:45): You send out Christmas cards. Beth Demme (24:47): I do, I love sending Christmas cards. Stephanie Kostopoulos (24:48): And it's special. It was on my fridge for a while. You never saw it. Anyways, we send out newsletters by email once a week. Beth sends her ... Beth Demme (24:55): Usually it's something related to what you might've heard in church the week before. Scripture-based and invites you to do a reflection. Stephanie Kostopoulos (25:03): It's very good and interesting and it's not super churchy, so ... I didn't love that description. Beth Demme (25:07): Okay. They're much better than I make them sound, apparently. Stephanie Kostopoulos (25:11): It's a blog. It's ... you have a blog where you have, you write about many different topics. Beth Demme (25:16): Yes. Stephanie Kostopoulos (25:17): Bible related. Beth Demme (25:18): It is, but it's not like- Stephanie Kostopoulos (25:19): It's not like a Bible lesson. Beth Demme (25:20): Right. Well, my whole goal is to demystify the Bible, to make it manageable and meaningful and to make it something that people are kind of curious about. So I usually try to keep it under 700 words, 500 to 700 words, so you can just read it in a couple minutes and it's designed so that hopefully you'll get something out of it. Stephanie Kostopoulos (25:36): Yes. I have a newsletter that will ... it's basically just updates in my newsletter. It will tell you, give you a link to our latest podcast. If I wrote a blog that week, I have a blog that I just write about random stuff, nothing substantial. My last blog post was about why I love Mondays. If you're interested, check it out. Beth Demme (25:56): Mondays are pretty great. Stephanie Kostopoulos (25:57): You can check out my newsletter. Just go to my website, stephaniekostopoulos.com and there'll be a sign up at the bottom for it. How do they sign up for yours? Beth Demme (26:07): Mine is bethdemme.com. Stephanie Kostopoulos (26:09): And there's a sign up like at the top? Beth Demme (26:11): At the top. Stephanie Kostopoulos (26:12): Okay. Beth Demme (26:12): We'll put links to all this in the show notes so don't feel like you have to, you know, immediately go there. You can pull up the show notes and then link right to it. Stephanie Kostopoulos (26:22): At the end of each show. We like to end with Questions for Reflection. These are questions that we wrote based on today's show. Beth will read them, leaving a little space in between each for you to pause the podcast to reflect on them in the car, wherever you are. Or you can download the PDF available on our website, dospod.us. Beth Demme (26:42): Number one, what does it mean to be the authority on you? Number two, how can you personally move past the surface level hurts to do the deeper work? Number three, who in your life is not self-aware? How does that affect your relationship with them? Number four, do you think you can truly love someone else without truly loving yourself first? Do you think this might lead to breakups? Stephanie Kostopoulos (27:08): This has been the Discovering Our Scars podcast. Thanks for joining us. Quotable
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Meet StephMental Health Advocate. Author. Podcast Host. DIYer. Greyhound Mom. 
Meet BethI'm a mom who laughs a lot, mainly at myself. #UMC Pastor, recent Seminary grad, public speaker, blogger, and sometimes lawyer. Learning to #LiveLoved. 
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