E93: What Does it Mean to BE KIND?

Show Notes

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Questions for Reflection

In each episode, we offer you a few prompts to think about how that day's conversation applies to you. Our supporters over at Buy Me a Coffee now have exclusive access to the PDF versions of all our Questions for Reflection. Join us today!  
 

1. What does it mean to you to be kind?
2. When was the last time someone treated you with kindness? How did it feel?
3. When was the last time you treated someone else with kindness? How did that feel?
4. Is it better to do something kind or receive a kindness? Which one feels better?
5. Do you spend time thinking about the kindness you have shown to others? Do you think that it's important?

Transcript

Beth Demme (00:03):
Welcome to the Discovering Our Scars podcast.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:06):
Where we share personal experiences so we can learn from each other. I'm Steph.
 
Beth Demme (00:09):
And I'm Beth.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:10):
I've been in recovery for 15 years and am the author of Discovering My Scars, my memoir about how what's done in the darkness eventually comes to light.
 
Beth Demme (00:17):
I'm a lawyer-turned-pastor, who's all about self-awareness and emotional health because I know what it's like to have neither of those things.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:23):
Beth and I have been friends for years, have gone through a recovery program together, and when I wanted to start a podcast, she was the only name that came to mind as co-host.
 
Beth Demme (00:30):
I didn't hesitate to say yes because I've learned a lot from sharing personal experiences with Steph over the years.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:35):
We value honest conversations and we hope you do, too.
 
Beth Demme (00:38):
On today's show. We're going to have an honest conversation titled: "What Does It Mean to be Kind?"
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (00:44):
Then we'll share a slice of life and the show will close with questions for reflection, where we invite you to reflect on the conversation in your own life.
 
Beth Demme (00:51):
So we recently had Skaie Knox on, and one of the things that she said about her husband is that he's a kind person. And so that got us talking about what does it mean to be kind and what is kindness?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (01:04):
Yeah, it seems like an odd topic. It's like, "Who doesn't talk about kindness?" That seems like a topic, but when something strikes me and I just go, "Huh, I never thought about that before." I think, "Oh, we need to talk about that on the podcast."
 
Beth Demme (01:21):
So, here we are.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (01:22):
So, here we are.
 
Beth Demme (01:23):
So, what is kindness? What is it? What are we even talking about? Is kindness an action? Is it a way of being? Is it some combination?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (01:32):
It's interesting because I think you hear that a lot, acts of kindness and kindness is some big extravagant thing. But when I really think about it, I think of it as kind people. There's people in my life that I know are kind and I wouldn't necessarily be able to sit here and give you a whole list of this was the act of kindness that I was, that's how I know. It's just little things. And to me, I think of kind people in my life, not the kind actions, although there are obviously examples of kindness a stranger would have showed me that I still remember, things like that. But I think of the people and really, all the people I'm close to my life are kind people because I get to choose the people in my life and I'll throw you out if you're not. So I think of it was as people and of presence and of something they do consistently, just being kind. What about you?
 
Beth Demme (02:30):
Well, it's interesting because I told Hannah, my daughter, who's been a guest on the podcast. I told her that-
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (02:35):
On the period episode.
 
Beth Demme (02:36):
Yes. I told her that we were doing an episode today about kindness. And so she and I were talking about it and she actually brought up that question. She said, "Well, are you going to talk about acts of kindness? Are you going to talk about people who are kind?" And I was like, "Yeah, that's one of the questions." That's one of the things we want to talk about. And because I do think of it more as acts of kindness, that idea of random of kindness or paying it forward, that's the first thing that comes to mind when I think of kindness. But I totally hear what you're saying, that some people are just kind and I do have a lot of people in my life who are kind and so I could see both sides of it.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (03:14):
Well, and I think kind people do acts of kindness all the time, even with strangers. Something as simple as holding the door open for another human being, I think is kind. It's such a simple act, but in that act, you are recognizing that you see the stranger coming at you, that they matter, and that they are within inches enough, where you can hold that door easily open for them, so I consider that a kind act. It doesn't matter the gender to me. I'll keep that darn door open if that's necessary.
 
Beth Demme (03:52):
Yeah. And if someone holds the door open for me, I always acknowledge it. I'll say, "Oh, thanks," or I put a little bit more pep in my step so that they're not standing there too long, some way to acknowledge, "Oh yeah, they're doing this for me," so.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (04:07):
Yeah, and my love language is acts of service, so that also is even doubly better for me when somebody, that is simple as holding a door. It's like, "Oh, wow. They saw me." It's not like I'm thinking about it for days or anything, but I think that's important to just show that little bit of kindness. I think the place, as I'm thinking, I feel like the place that we see the least kindness is driving.
 
Beth Demme (04:35):
People don't like to share the road, right?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (04:37):
I feel that is the worst. We see the most unkind people when it's driving. I mean, I was just driving the other day and I was merging onto the interstate and the guy that was behind me sped up in that lane that I have to get over on because my lane is about to end. I'm like, "What in the world, man?" That was very unkind."
 
Beth Demme (04:58):
He could totally see you coming.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (05:00):
He knew I was coming and I was in my little Mini Cooper. He's like, "I will take this sucker on." And he just speeds up and all of us have to slow down because there's a couple more of us, but it's universally known. You let the people in front of you get over when that lane is closing.
 
Beth Demme (05:15):
That's right.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (05:15):
It's very unkind. It's very, and to me, I think the opposite of kind is selfish.
 
Beth Demme (05:20):
Right. I agree. I agree. And I think that driving is actually a good example of that. And I remember when I was teaching my son to drive, we were on the interstate a lot at that point because that's when I was serving a church over in Quincy and so we had to be on I-10 a lot. And I remember teaching him specifically like, "Okay, when you come up on this exit, you need to change lanes because you're going to keep going and these people are going to need to merge. And look, we have three lanes here, so you can just get over and then there's room for everybody." That's such a basic-
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (05:50):
I mean, that's like a rule of the road. That's not even being, I mean, yes, it's kind, but because you don't have to. You don't physically have to move over, but although I don't know if it's a law. Is that a law to move over?
 
Beth Demme (06:03):
No, only for police officers.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (06:05):
Yeah. We all have to follow certain rules in order for us to not have accidents. Well, there's still plenty, but-
 
Beth Demme (06:14):
But merging does take some cooperation, so come on. You see a car there. You know what to do.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (06:20):
So I'm curious. When you think of kindness, an act of kindness or a kind person, what does that feel like when someone's done something kind for you?
 
Beth Demme (06:30):
I think it's one of those things where it's, you know it when you see it. You know it when you experience it. I think the best way to describe it is that I feel seen. I feel like my humanity is acknowledged in some way, even if it is a small thing, like opening the door or making room so I can merge or when my husband replaces the toilet paper roll. These are things, it's like, "Yeah, that was something small, but somebody thought about me and what was going to be convenient or inconvenient for me, and so I think I feel seen." What about you?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (07:03):
Yeah. I was just thinking when you were saying that, my neighbors will sometimes bring in my trash cans and I didn't realize that. They've done it a handful of times and I don't think I realized that at first. I think I maybe just was like, "Oh, I brought mine in." Then I finally realized that they were doing it and I was just like, "Wow, that's so simple, but I feel so special." I was seen and that they realized this is something I needed, something small that they could do. And yeah, it just a breath of fresh air. That's something I don't have to do, so yeah. I definitely feel like I'm seen, I matter, and it definitely feels special when it's something that I definitely need done, like bringing the trash cans. There's no doubt that I need that brought in.
 
Beth Demme (07:53):
But it wouldn't be helpful if they brought it in before the pick up had happened, right?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (07:56):
Yes, that would not be helpful or if there's something that I like done a certain way, if they did it without asking if this was something that would be helpful. I have a friend that had some logs in his backyard and they had just been sitting there and I said, "Hey, would that be helpful to bring to the front so they could be taken out?" He's like, "Oh, yeah." And I was like, "Okay, I'll do it on trash day," but I didn't want to just randomly go because maybe he wanted them back there. You don't know. So asking if that's something... And actually I also was going to mow his yard and I asked and I was like, "Hey, would that be helpful?" He's like, "Yes, but funny enough, my other neighbor just asked and she did it and she mowed my lawn." And I was like, "Okay, great," so always ask because you never know if it's already being done or if it even needs to be done. What feels better to you, to do something kind for someone or to have something kind done for you?
 
Beth Demme (08:53):
Well, I think they both feel good. And usually if someone is doing something kind for me, it's usually, well, I guess probably always unexpected because I think if I expected it, it would be something different. It wouldn't be a kindness. It would be them doing what they were supposed to do or something like that, so I like the surprise element of it or the unexpected element of when someone else does something kind.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (09:20):
In your mind, do you think that your husband's kind?
 
Beth Demme (09:22):
Yes, he is. He's a kind person. He treats me with a lot of kindness.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (09:25):
So he's just a kind person in general. So does it surprise you when he's kind or does it surprise you when he's unkind or is he ever unkind?
 
Beth Demme (09:32):
I actually can't think of a time that I thought he was unkind, but I think there are things he does that I take for granted that other people would see as a kindness. When he takes out the trash, I don't consider that a kindness. That's our deal.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (09:47):
Well, that's a household thing that needs to be done, though. It's not necessarily he's doing it for you. He's doing for the household.
 
Beth Demme (09:54):
Right, but since he and I share a bathroom and it's in our bedroom, so nobody else uses it, recently, he really did. He changed the toilet paper roll. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, that was so kind." And I don't know why. It just struck me as-
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:09):
But it's both your bathrooms.
 
Beth Demme (10:10):
Right. I know.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:12):
Do you always change it though?
 
Beth Demme (10:15):
I don't know. I feel like I always change it but he probably feels like he always changes it. I don't know. I didn't ask him.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:24):
Well, you just, you saw it and that-
 
Beth Demme (10:26):
Yes, yeah.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:27):
Yeah. Well, and that's happened. My house, I'm in charge of everything. It's my house. But I noticed a few times my mom has changed my paper towels or something. And I was like, "Oh," and she's like, "Of course I would do that." There was none left. I was like, "Yeah, but thanks."
 
Beth Demme (10:44):
Right, thanks.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (10:45):
She's like, "Well, I just thought you were leaving them for me." I was like, "No." Then it became like, "Wait." But yeah, my mom will do little things like that. And also the biggest kindness anyone can show is, for a dog owner, is my mom will pick up after the dog.
 
Beth Demme (11:01):
She will?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (11:02):
She will, yes. And so basically, we made a rule because I kept asking and she was annoyed. If you see them use the bathroom, you pick it up. And we only made it a rule because I kept ask- She would be like, "Tosh went to the bathroom." And I'd be like, "Did you pick it up?" She's like, "Of course I did." So the rule is, if you see it, you pick it up.
 
Beth Demme (11:24):
So now you don't have to ask.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (11:25):
I don't have to ask. So she'll tell me that they went to the bathroom. I'll say, "Thank you," and I know that she cleaned it up. So that's very kind.
 
Beth Demme (11:32):
You recently did something kind for me because I was out of town and an Amazon delivery that was supposed to come before I left, because by the way, Prime is not Prime anymore. Prime isn't taking two days. Now it takes a week.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (11:44):
Lame.
 
Beth Demme (11:45):
Whatevs. So I had already gone out of town and then these things came, one of which was a rug, which is not a small thing. And you went over for me and you got it off of my front porch and put it in my garage. And then a couple of days later, I had to ask you to do it again, so that was very you to do that for me, to take your time, to go out. It wasn't convenient. It was raining. We're not next door neighbors, so you had to go out of your way to do it, so yeah.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (12:16):
I don't think that would ever be possible for us to be next door neighbors unless you super downsized.
 
Beth Demme (12:21):
One day, I'm going to downsize.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (12:22):
Then we'll be next door.
 
Beth Demme (12:24):
I'm not going tiny, but I'm downsizing. Just kidding. I'm not.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (12:30):
I'm always willing to do anything like that for friends. If anybody asks me, I would be willing to do it because it's something that I can do. Make it happen.
 
Beth Demme (12:40):
My dad, he's passed away, but he was a very, very kind person, was known for that, was known for his kindnesses. But you were talking about how it's not always kind if you do something that's not helpful. One time, and this was a long, long time ago, Stephen and I hadn't even been married that long. And my dad felt like my pantry was disorganized and he was going to help me by organizing my pantry. My mom and I had gone out shopping for the day or something and we got back and he was like, "I organized your pantry." He and I just didn't have the same systems and it was not super well received. But he intended to be kind, right? He wasn't trying to say, "You don't know what you're doing and I can do this better." It wasn't that at all. It was like, "Oh, here's something I can do for her." I don't know.
 
Beth Demme (13:31):
When my kids were little, my parents would come to visit. My mom would help me get caught up on laundry. And it was just because she had time and she could do it. He, thought he was doing something like that and it was not. It was not good.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (13:42):
So PSA for all men out there, if you think you can organize better than the woman in your life, you may be able to and that's great. But before you put those skills to the test, just check.
 
Beth Demme (13:55):
Just have a conversation.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (13:56):
Just be like, "Hey." And actually, as you were talking, it reminded me of a friend I had, still a friend of mine, but lives in Orlando. And he was the cleanest person, super clean. And when I was out of town in Tallahassee, he had the key to my apartment because I had him check on stuff, but he cleaned my whole shower. I hate cleaning showers and I hate cleaning and general. He cleaned my whole shower and my whole bathroom. He probably might've cleaned the whole apartment. It wasn't that big. And that was so kind. Oh, he also replaced the shower head because I'd been complaining about it. Yeah. He's really good friend and very clean. But he would do just really nice things like that for me. And we had discussed it. Maybe that's why he cleaned it, because he said he would put on a new shower head and then he went ahead and cleaned everything and might've put it on a new inner shower curtain as well.
 
Beth Demme (14:49):
Wow, that was above and beyond.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (14:52):
So yeah, he's good people. Yeah.
 
Beth Demme (14:54):
So how do we show gratitude for someone else's kindness? When he cleaned your shower for you, is a simple thank you good enough or do we owe someone something after they've shown us a kindness?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (15:10):
I think it depends. I think there's like a natural thing, where I think it's where we feel like, "Okay, now I owe someone something," but I don't have a checklist in my head. If someone does something for me, I have to like, "Okay, I need to remember. And then I need to do something really nice for them." I don't try to keep that checklist in my head because then it's not just a kindness. It's an obligation. As you were talking about that, it's making me think of pay it forward. That's something that people say about kindness and I feel like, "Yes, pay it forward," but in a sense of just be kind to people always. I don't try to intentionally, "How can I be kind today?" And I'm not saying that that's wrong. Maybe that's something that would help you to be kind, is to think about it. And at the end of the day, what kindness did I do?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (16:08):
For me, that's not something that I do or feel like it is necessary, but it reminds me of, for a couple of years ago, I think it's still going on, somebody paid for somebody's Starbucks behind them in line. And then the next person paid for their person for Starbucks behind them and dah-dah-dah. And it was going on for an hour or day or something. And people still do that. People will pay for the person behind them. And what's interesting is, on the surface, that's pretty cool. That's pretty kind. But then also is it or is it just complicated because then I think, "Well, how was that cashier dealing with that?" The person that comes up to their window, also it's drive through, so it's fast. The person has to give them their order, but they paid for the person behind them. So they have to deal with two check out things. I don't know how it is to be a cashier, but I feel there's stuff involved and I feel like that's complicated. Is it kind or is it actually just really annoying? I don't know.
 
Beth Demme (17:09):
This exact thing happened to me, not even a week ago, this exact thing.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (17:12):
At Starbucks?
 
Beth Demme (17:13):
No, it was at Dairy Queen. So Hannah and I had decided that we were going to go get Blizzards. And so we went through the drive-through and I had a coupon. I had a coupon for buy one, get one free Blizzards and we got up to pay and they said, "Your order is free because the person in front of you paid." And they did it like that. "Your order is free..." And then there was this long awkward pause, "...because the person in front of you paid." And I was like, "Oh, I had a coupon." So they gave us the Blizzards and I was like, "Well, I would like to pay for the person behind me." I felt obligated to do that. And because I had a coupon, I was only going to pay for one Blizzard. And the person behind me had gotten two full lunch meals and so it really didn't work out very well.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (17:59):
How much did you pay it?
 
Beth Demme (18:00):
It ended up, I don't know, like 12 bucks or something. It wasn't a ton of money-
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:04):
It was more than a Blizzard.
 
Beth Demme (18:05):
But it was way more than one Blizzard, so-
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:08):
And you still have your coupon?
 
Beth Demme (18:09):
No, because it expired. So yeah, I mean, when I said, "Well, I'll pay for the person behind me," they went, "Oh." It must have been a burden for them to keep track of it. But I know that whoever started it meant it to be a kindness and it just by going on and on and on, I guess it had gotten out of hand, but-
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (18:30):
I think if it was one and done, that would feel like a kindness, a surprise. But that fact that you felt obligated to do the next one and the next one, then it's not kind, it's just an obligation.
 
Beth Demme (18:42):
I did pay for the person behind me once where I was the one who started it, because the way the drive-through at this particular place was set up was weird. And I realized after I got in line that I had cut someone off and I was like, "Oh." So when I got to the window, I was like, "I cut off the lady behind me so I just want to buy her lunch, too. Just tell her I said, I was sorry." And that was a way to make up for an unkindness.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:08):
And if it was said, hopefully they were able to say it like that. If it was said like that, then I wouldn't feel obligated to buy behind me too. If it's just random, then... I'm not saying that it's a bad thing to pay for the people behind you, but when you really think about is it kind for everyone?
 
Beth Demme (19:25):
It's interesting how it felt in that moment when I received someone else's kindness, how it was hard to just receive it. I felt like, "Oh, I'm a bad person if I don't continue this on." That sense of obligation was interesting.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (19:42):
Yeah. It's interesting. I wonder if it's something that everybody feels. I don't know. I don't know if I've ever been in that situation, paying for the person behind you, actually. I'm not sure. I can't remember.
 
Beth Demme (19:56):
So we got the idea for talking about kindness because Skaie had said that her husband is kind. And then now we've been talking about different acts of kindness. What do you think she meant to describe him as a kind person?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (20:09):
Well, I don't have to think about it because I asked her.
 
Beth Demme (20:12):
Exactly.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (20:12):
I actually was able to talk to her on the phone the other day and I brought it up because I was like, "Well, actually, you inspired our next episode as well." So I thought it was just very interesting, her insight. And the first thing she said was he always assumes the best of her. That is how he shows his kindness, he's always assuming the best. So you're a human being and sometimes you might be hungry. Sometimes you might be sad. Sometimes you might not feel like the nicest person, but-
 
Beth Demme (20:47):
Sometimes I might be all of those things at one time, hungry, sad and not nice.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (20:52):
Exactly. And so even when all of these things are factors, he always assumes the best in her and always assumes positive intent. So if she says something that might sound off or maybe even offend him in some way, before he would be like, "Oh my gosh, ba-dah-dah-dah-dah." He would ask for clarification. So this is what I heard. Is this what you meant? Oh no, no, no. I meant that dah-dah-dah-dah-dah. I just, not thinking straight right now. Assuming positive intent, asking for clarification, and also she had mentioned on the podcast that they've both done a lot of their own work on their own stuff and they recognize that. Also, he reassures her in a lot of ways, based on some of the trauma and challenges she's had in her life. He knows that and he doesn't use that against her, obviously, but also uses that in a way, when he communicates with her, he knows her past and makes sure that the things that he's saying or the reactions he's having doesn't trigger those things or if something might trigger it, that they talk it through together. So I thought that was amazing of how she described really in depth, this kindness.
 
Beth Demme (22:06):
Yeah, he's aware of what she needs and he makes an effort to meet her where she is. I think that is kind.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (22:14):
Yeah, I agree. So I really liked that, always assuming positive intent because that's actually something at Apple, we had a list of things that we did as an employee. And one of those was always assume positive intent and I learned that there is... When someone comes in, loud and angry, dah-dah-dah, assume positive intent and let's go from there. A lot of times they just want a free computer, so you also have to keep that in mind. But yeah, that's trickled down in my life is, assume the best in people. So I tried to do that with people I meet, is just assume positive intent unless I see otherwise. I don't just give them the passcode to my house or something right away. I do.
 
Beth Demme (23:03):
I had to earn that passcode, y'all.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:04):
Oh yeah, Beth has passcode to my house. So don't ask her though. So Beth, when you do something kind for somebody, do you expect kindness to be returned to you from that person in a timely manner?
 
Beth Demme (23:17):
No, and I think that if I went into it with that mindset, I wouldn't be being kind. I would be doing something else. I'd be almost manipulating them and so that's the opposite of kindness, I think. Well, we talked about the opposite of kindness is really selfishness. And so if I'm really doing it so that they have to do something for me, it's like, "What can I get out of this?" That's actually selfish.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (23:37):
Yeah. That's funny because that actually reminds me of the show The Office, one of the characters, if you know the show, I know you don't, but if you know the show, Dwight, there's an episode. I can't remember exactly the episode where he gives somebody a loaf of bread or something. And, they're like, "Thank you." He's like, "Okay, now you're in my debt. Now you need to do something for me." He was like, "Now you must do this for me," which is that stereotype, that you do something nice for me, you do... But really, I think when kindness is really given just in all aspects of life, I think it just inspires the... When someone's kind to me, it gives me a good feeling and I want to be kind to others. So if we're all kind to each other, we are going to then reciprocate kindness, maybe not necessarily to the person that gave us kindness, but we're going to reciprocate it because we have that feeling of being seen. We're going to let someone else be seen. So I think by us just always being kind and not expecting anything in return, we're actually are going to keep returning that into the world, just by respecting and assuming positive intent in all people.
 
Beth Demme (24:52):
We have so much fun making this podcast and we've heard from some of you that you're wondering what is the best way to support us. So we've decided to expand the podcast experience using buymeacoffee.com. You can go there and buy us a cup of coffee or for Steph, a cup of tea, or you can actually become a monthly supporter and that will give you access to PDFs of the questions for reflection as well as pictures, outtakes, polls, and more.
 
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Stephanie Kostopoulos (26:00):
Well, I wanted to remind you that we are on all podcast platforms. The biggest podcast platform currently is Apple Podcasts. And if you are in that podcast app right now, please do us a favor and go all the way down to the bottom and click that fifth star to give us a five-star rating. That really helps us get found by other people. You can probably rate on other sites as well, so if you're in another app, please take a second to look and see. Also, a new growing platform is Amazon Music. And I personally use Amazon music for my music. I have all my Echo devices in my house that I play music with. But I was looking the other day, I was searching for something random and I realized all types of stuff come up in the search. And when I typed in scars, our podcasts come up and I was like, "That's us. That's so cool," so we are everywhere you want to be.
 
Beth Demme (26:55):
And leaving us a review or rating as a kind thing to do.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (26:59):
Yes. Thank you so much. That would be kind. Also, calling in to the podcast is very kind and we very much appreciate it. And we have call, another call from Joey. He had called once before and I wanted to play this because it was a really great message.
Joey (27:17):
Hey, Steph and Beth, it's Joey McGee from Bryan, Texas again.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (27:19):
Hey, Joey.
Joey (27:20):
I just listened to your Juneteenth episode, so I thank you. Thank you for sharing that. That was awesome. And as I was listening to the conversation, it was just healing for me to hear it, so thanks for sharing that. I hope it spreads like wildfire. Juneteenth as a national holiday, yes, hopefully it serves as a conduit for us to visit our American history, even though that was a difficult part of our history. And anyway, thank you. I really appreciate y'all sharing that. There was another episode I listened to a while back and I don't know if it was Black Lives Matter or Black Lives Still Matter, one of those episodes. But anyway, y'all talked about books. I have a book recommendation. If you haven't listened to it, I've listened to it. I didn't read it. It's called The Warmth of Other Suns.
 
Beth Demme (28:32):
It's on my list.
Joey (28:33):
It's a really great book.
 
Beth Demme (28:34):
Isabel Allende.
Joey (28:34):
By Isabel Wilkerson.
 
Beth Demme (28:34):
Oh, Wilkerson.
Joey (28:36):
And highly recommended whether you read it or listen to it. So I know you guys both don't jive with this, but love you guys. And I appreciate what you're doing. Bye.
 
Beth Demme (28:49):
Thank you, Joey. We love you too. Oh my goodness.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (28:52):
Thank you so much. That is awesome. I will say I actually listened to the voicemail. I think he sent it a couple of weeks ago and I got the book. I ordered the book. Oh my gosh. This is the thickest book I think I have ever seen. It is so thick. It rivals Harry Potter, but I haven't started it yet because it scared me with the size, but I'm going to read it because Joey recommended it and I want to read it.
 
Beth Demme (29:16):
I have it on my list. And to be honest, I've had it on my list for a while, but I haven't listened to it, because Joey, I listen to books too, because she has two books. So she has one called Cast and she has one called The Warmth of Other Suns and I've gotten conflicting information about which one should you do first? But I'm just going to dive in with The Warmth of Other Suns since he said it was good. I'm just going to start there.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (29:38):
And I feel like Darryl recommended that as well, but I cut it out. For some reason, I feel like he recommended multiple books or during the episode. It sounded familiar to me when Joey said it. I don't think it's in the episode anymore, I think he might've, I don't know. I felt like I heard that name before. But anyways, I'm very excited to read it. I'm scared, but excited.
 
Beth Demme (30:01):
All right. So I have a news thing for you. A bit of news, that-
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (30:07):
A bit of news.
 
Beth Demme (30:07):
A bit of news. This is from a couple of weeks ago. And I'm curious to get your feedback on it, but I'm also curious, based on the conversation we've had about kindness. So there's a restaurant called The Stumble In Bar and Grill and Londonderry, New Hampshire. And a few weeks ago, a man came in and he ordered $38 worth of food and drinks. And then he left a $16,000 tip. And he wants to remain anonymous. So they haven't been able to interview him. I'll put a link to this in the show notes so you can read the story for yourselves. But the owner said that it was enough money, that it was a double or a triple paycheck for the people who had worked on that shift, that were going to share the tips. I don't know. Is it kind? Do you think it's kind and I also want to say that he's been back to the restaurant a few times since then and has not done it again. He just did it the once.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (31:07):
Well, it's an odd number to me. So I would be suspicious. Why 16,000? That's an odd number to me.
 
Beth Demme (31:14):
What would be a less odd number, like if it were 15,000? Is that less odd than 16,000?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (31:20):
A thousand.
 
Beth Demme (31:20):
Oh 1,000, okay.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (31:22):
I would be like, "Oh, wow." I don't know. For some reason, over that just seems odd to me. I think a thousand would be like, "Oh my gosh." I think a hundred would be exciting and less weird. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. I mean, it just seems a little strange to me.
 
Beth Demme (31:37):
The restaurant owner said, this is the quote out of the article that I'll post. He says, "It just says there's good, kind-hearted people out there who realize that people might have to struggle." And because of COVID, the restaurant industry was hit pretty hard and he felt like it was a response to that, to say, "I know it's been a hard year."
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (31:58):
But the tip-
 
Beth Demme (31:59):
Let me help out.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (31:59):
Does the tip go to the whole restaurant or just to the waiter?
 
Beth Demme (32:02):
No. The owner said that it was distributed among the staff.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (32:06):
No, there's nothing wrong with that. Yes, that's kind. I wouldn't say at all it's not. It's just an odd number to me, but yeah. I mean, I think that's really great if it's something that was able to be distributed amongst all the workers that day, to be able to-
 
Beth Demme (32:24):
I think he wanted it distributed because the owner said that since this person has come back in, he's talked to him and said, "Do you really want to do this?" And he said, "No, I really want it to go to everybody and really wanted to share this money."
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (32:37):
Yeah, I think that's great.
 
Beth Demme (32:37):
So yeah.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (32:37):
Yeah.
 
Beth Demme (32:38):
An act of kindness [crosstalk 00:32:40].
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (32:39):
I mean, I would have done a thousand or 2000, but that's just, I literally, why would you pick 16? Why?
 
Beth Demme (32:50):
Maybe he knew they were struggling or something. It doesn't say that in the news article, but maybe.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (32:53):
Yes, I think that's very kind. What's the biggest tip you've ever given, Beth?
 
Beth Demme (32:58):
Does it count if it was my husband and I, and he did it?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (33:01):
Sure.
 
Beth Demme (33:01):
Okay. And do you want to know the biggest one on purpose or the biggest one on accident?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (33:05):
Both.
 
Beth Demme (33:06):
Okay. So the biggest whole accident was we were in London and we wanted a cab driver to take us to Abbey Road and we have the kids with us. And so we got there and it was rushed to get out of the cab or whatever because it's a busy road. And my husband handed the guy, he paid for the cab fare and the guy was like, "Wow, thank you." And we got out of the cab. My husband's like, "Why did he react like that?" And he looked back at the money in his hand, he was like, "Oh, I gave him a hundred pound note instead of what I meant to give him." Oops. So actually I don't remember how much of a tip it was, but it was a lot. And the other thing that comes to mind when you ask about tipping is a couple of times a year, we'll go to Waffle House and we always tip really big there because I feel like they're always so genuinely nice and it's easy to do and so we usually leave pretty big tips there.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (34:01):
Well, what's a big tip?
 
Beth Demme (34:03):
Well, we'll leave a hundred dollar bill on a $20. It's not $16,000.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (34:08):
Yeah, a hundred. Yeah. I think that would be great.
 
Beth Demme (34:10):
Yeah, a hundred bucks.
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (34:11):
Yeah, good job. At the end of each episode, we end with questions for reflection. These are questions based on today's show that Beth will read and leave a little pause between or you can find a PDF of them on our Buy Me a Coffee page.
 
Beth Demme (34:25):
Number one, what does it mean to you to be kind? Number two, when was the last time someone treated you with kindness? How did it feel? Number three, when was the last time you treated someone else with kindness? How did that feel? Number four, is it better to do something kind or receive a kindness? Which one feels better? And number five, do you spend time thinking about the kindness you have shown to others? Do you think that it's important?
 
Stephanie Kostopoulos (34:55):
This has been the Discovering Our Scars podcast. Thank you for joining us.